Marshall coach reassigned

[oldhornet]

Names of possible replacements?

[Smoaky]

It's insane how people try to take a complex situation and boil it down to something as petty as an US Vs. THEM or a cut and dried or black/white issue with no grey.

 

This wasn't a simple thing going on. And no one should be "excited" about this.

 

Couple of things.....

 

----------

 

First off.....MISD has NOT shown a propensity to go after coaches based on performance on the field. To insinuate that is ludicrous.

 

Coach Harris would most likely STILL be the AD/HC if his non-football issues had been resolved. His undoing had very little to do with his W/L record on the field. If those issues hadn't occurred, or had been resolved in a timely manner....I think most believe he would still be here.

 

Southern left of his own volition. He was offered another job in another place and took it. I'm sure he could have stayed in Marshall as long as he wanted to be here.

 

Harper was the HC/AD for 11 seasons. He wasn't run off. He retired.

 

Parker left for North Texas after (8?) seasons.

 

All of the above coaches had successful.....and not so successful seasons. And MISD sent NONE of them packing based on winning percentages.

 

So to say MISD has some sort of turnstile going I think is unfair.

----

 

Secondly....

 

This staff was thrown into an impossible situation. I blame MISD for that. The Harris situation should have been resolved MUCH sooner than it was. The fact that he resigned in JULY of last year made a total and complete mess of things.

 

There was no way MISD was going to hire and install a new staff 3-4 weeks before two-a-days were scheduled to start.

 

The easy and "safe" thing to do was to hire within and keep the existing systems intact.

 

The problem though, was that no one on the existing staff had HC experience. And Richters had very little coordinator experience.

 

Even struggling programs like Pine Tree and Nac manage to hire guys that already have HC expereince. Why wouldn't a program like Marshall do the same??? I'm willing to bet that Richters was (BY FAR) the youngest HC in 14-4A. I'd be willing to bet he was the youngest in both 4A districts. He and his staff, IMHO, were not ready. They had not put in enough time to be a HC.

 

But the keys to the kingdom were handed over because it was easy.

 

Result?

 

2-8 in 2011

1-9 in 2012

 

---------------

 

Thirdly.....

 

The recurring theme this season has been youth, inexperience, and that the talent pool was down.

 

I don't think anyone would argue that.

 

But.....Marshall has had inexperienced teams before. We've had youthful teams before. We've had to rebuild before. And we've had talent droughts too (late 90's).

 

None of those above situations produced the outcomes we saw in 2011 and 2012. None of those down years produced anything in the vicinity of what we've seen.

 

The collapse of this team was titanic. Total implosion.

 

It's a tough sale to people that this colossal collapse just coincidentally occurred simultaneously as Richters took over.

 

Marshall was 1-9 in 2002, just as we were in 2012. Other than the records, the similarities end there. The numbers are MIND BOGGLING.

 

Again...this complete implosion just happened to occur when this staff took over.

 

Harris had tough years. Southern. Harper. All of them had painful seasons.

 

Points For/Against 2011: 288/361

Points For/Against 2012: 201/455*

Points For/Against Combined: 489/816

 

PPG For/Against 2011: 28.8/36.1

PPG For/Against 2012: 20.1/45.5

PPG For/Against Combined: 24.5/40.8

 

Average Margin of loss 2011: 13.2

Average Margin of loss 2012: 30.3

 

Number of games greater than 60 points were surrendered: 3 (all in 2012)

Number of games greater than 50 points were surrendered: 5

Number of games greater than 40 points were surrendered: 13

 

Think about that. Marshall gave up 40 or more points in 13 of this staffs' 17 losses.

 

More???

 

Marshall was scoreless in the first half of six games this year.

 

Most mind-boggling stat:

 

If you were to take the 110+ year history of the Mavericks and number the biggest blowouts in program history, this staff has FOUR of the top TEN on their clock in the last two seasons.

 

Magically when this staff took over.

 

------------------

 

Lastly.....

 

What's the risk? Really.

 

If Marshall gets a new coach and he does poorly, then how is that any different from what we've had the last 2 seasons? Nothing changes.

 

But there is the chance he could turn it around.

 

Isn't the risk Vs. reward worth the radical change?

 

Not far to fall when your 3-17.

 

----------------

 

Talent.

 

Maybe. Just maybe.....help is on the way.

 

The MJHS 7th grade won district

The MJHS 8th grade won district

 

The freshman and JV teams were competitive, especially in district play. That says a lot considering the varsity practically had a JV roster.

 

--------------

 

It's a tough situation. And I don't think there is an easy fix.

 

I hope some of the players that are in the hallways return next year with new leadership. I hope some of them that went to other schools (like Jefferson, who didn't make the playoffs either....ouch) will return. And that the guys currently in the program get excited about the new prospects.

-----------------

 

 

Let the speculation begin....

 

 

I don't think anyone is blaming Marshall for this decision or when it came about. But, I think you answered the question with your response and opinion.

 

From 1984-2006, Marshall had three head coaches in football (Parker, Harper and Southern), and now, with their next hire, it will be three changes in four-years.

 

Are there other common denominators during these struggled other than who has been the head football coach?

 

1984 5-5-0 164-211 Dennis Parker

1985 2-8-0 118-255 Dennis Parker

1986 4-6-0 150-137 Dennis Parker

1987 8-2-0 257-168 Dennis Parker

1988 12-1-0 411-148 Dennis Parker

1989 11-3-1 359-175 Dennis Parker

1990* 14-2-0 424-211 Dennis Parker (State Champions)

1991 4-5-1 164-198 Bill Harper

1992 6-4-0 230-169 Bill Harper

1993 6-6-0 206-231 Bill Harper

1994 8-4-0 232-215 Bill Harper

1995 8-3-1 249-162 Bill Harper

1996 11-1-0 399-187 Bill Harper

1997 5-5-0 232-198 Bill Harper

1998 7-3-0 266-147 Bill Harper

1999 4-6-0 215-205 Bill Harper

2000 6-4-0 300-220 Bill Harper

2001 5-5-0 278-253 Bill Harper

2002 1-9-0 130-285 Rodney Southern

2003 5-5-0 216-266 Rodney Southern

2004 11-4-0 484-182 Rodney Southern (State Championship Appearance)

2005 13-2-0 457-226 Rodney Southern (State Championship Appearance)

2006 6-4-0 Rodney Southern

2007 7-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2008 6-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2009 9-4-0 Thedrick Harris

2010 6-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2011 2-8-0 Alex Richters

2012 1-9-0 Alex Richters

 

David Smoak

[sportsstud]

He does do his research, and it should be commended.

[BigRedFan]

Your post was a jumbled mess. Don't blame Pops for trying his best to decipher the message. Dang!

Dang!!

Who gave him the right to decipher anything? I have told him repeatly on here and pms to ignore them.

[Coach Rab]

I don't think anyone is blaming Marshall for this decision or when it came about. But, I think you answered the question with your response and opinion.

 

From 1984-2006, Marshall had three head coaches in football (Parker, Harper and Southern), and now, with their next hire, it will be three changes in four-years.

 

Are there other common denominators during these struggled other than who has been the head football coach?

 

1984 5-5-0 164-211 Dennis Parker

1985 2-8-0 118-255 Dennis Parker

1986 4-6-0 150-137 Dennis Parker

1987 8-2-0 257-168 Dennis Parker

1988 12-1-0 411-148 Dennis Parker

1989 11-3-1 359-175 Dennis Parker

1990* 14-2-0 424-211 Dennis Parker (State Champions)

1991 4-5-1 164-198 Bill Harper

1992 6-4-0 230-169 Bill Harper

1993 6-6-0 206-231 Bill Harper

1994 8-4-0 232-215 Bill Harper

1995 8-3-1 249-162 Bill Harper

1996 11-1-0 399-187 Bill Harper

1997 5-5-0 232-198 Bill Harper

1998 7-3-0 266-147 Bill Harper

1999 4-6-0 215-205 Bill Harper

2000 6-4-0 300-220 Bill Harper

2001 5-5-0 278-253 Bill Harper

2002 1-9-0 130-285 Rodney Southern

2003 5-5-0 216-266 Rodney Southern

2004 11-4-0 484-182 Rodney Southern (State Championship Appearance)

2005 13-2-0 457-226 Rodney Southern (State Championship Appearance)

2006 6-4-0 Rodney Southern

2007 7-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2008 6-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2009 9-4-0 Thedrick Harris

2010 6-5-0 Thedrick Harris

2011 2-8-0 Alex Richters

2012 1-9-0 Alex Richters

 

David Smoak

 

Good point Smoaky. Looks like a roller coaster cycle of Really good down to average, occasional bad, then good again. Marshall will produce athletes. Keeping them on the field is always the bigger challenge when it comes to grades and injuries in Marshall. For as long as I can remember, there has always been plenty of talent, just never a lot of depth.

[sportsstud]

Mavchamp and Mavgrad unfortunately speak out of both sides of their mouth and will bully you if you don't agree with their philosophy. Understand this, what happened yesterday happened, and my life moves on with the decision. What I find fascinating is how you call this a junior varsity roster which not only is insulting to the kids you claim to "care so much about," but it also goes back to how terrible you and others feel this coach and staff were. Were they great? No, Did they get the job done? No, Were their hands severely tied or handcuffed behind their backs, heck yeahI love how you're telling everyone in here how the roster was of a junior varsity level, yet when someone else says the talent is down you throw a hissy fit and you talk about all the All-Stars this team had. Mavsgrad talks about how the talent is still there but now brings up grades, injuries and a lack of depth, yet when someone else brings those things up in the regular season he/she is branded as an evil person who is doing nothing but trying to bring the kids down. Best of luck to Richters the young men and the new athletic/director and coaching staff, but please stop the insanity!

[Mavchamp]

I am really hoping Marshall hires Coach McFarlin. He could wind up back in the same district after next realignment. How awesome would that be?

 

I think he's a winner no doubt. But can he do what he's done in whitehouse with a school like marshall?

 

The demographics between the two schools are nothing alike. WH is a majority white school.

 

Marshall has a white population of about 48%. Whitehouse is probably in the 90s.

 

Whitehouse is economically different than most East Texas schools. They are a wealthier community.

 

Marshall is more on par with the majority of East Texas: Nac, Lufkin, MP and other towns of similar size.

 

Can he do it in a more diverse, financially frugal district than the perceived Utopia like we see in places like WH and Hallsville.

 

Fair question ?

[BillyClydePuckett]

Didn't he do well at Daingerfield?

[LoboFan07]

Mavchamp and Mavgrad unfortunately speak out of both sides of their mouth and will bully you if you don't agree with their philosophy.

 

[Mavchamp]

Mavchamp and Mavgrad unfortunately speak out of both sides of their mouth and will bully you if you don't agree with their philosophy. Understand this, what happened yesterday happened, and my life moves on with the decision. What I find fascinating is how you call this a junior varsity roster which not only is insulting to the kids you claim to "care so much about," but it also goes back to how terrible you and others feel this coach and staff were. Were they great? No, Did they get the job done? No, Were their hands severely tied or handcuffed behind their backs, heck yeahI love how you're telling everyone in here how the roster was of a junior varsity level, yet when someone else says the talent is down you throw a hissy fit and you talk about all the All-Stars this team had. Mavsgrad talks about how the talent is still there but now brings up grades, injuries and a lack of depth, yet when someone else brings those things up in the regular season he/she is branded as an evil person who is doing nothing but trying to bring the kids down. Best of luck to Richters the young men and the new athletic/director and coaching staff, but please stop the insanity!

 

Let me tell you something, newbie. I'd rather speak out of both sides of my mouth as you say, than to speak out of my rear end like you do.

 

I'm convinced you either can't read, don't read, or read into what you see.

 

I haven't bullied anyone. You think just because someone doesn't agree with YOU they wrong and you are right because you are the paragon of sports knowledge.

 

I called the Mavericks a JV roster because they had so many freshman and sophmores STARTING. How is that an insult??? They had more underclassmen starting than most varisty teams do. That's not an insult, that's stating a fact that the team was YOUNG.

 

And I want to see ONCE anyone said anything about all stars. I said in my original post that the team was young, inexperienced, and that the talent pool was down this season. I guess you missed that. i didn't throw a hissy. I said it myself. TALENT IS DOWN. I've said it multiple times on multiple threads.

 

 

No one has called Richters evil, bad....that's ridiculous. I think he's an outstanding guy. And I've praised his stand on disciple many, many times.

 

I have been critical of his performance. 3-17 says it all. Do you think Longview would let that fly? Lufkin? Hardly.

 

I'd like to know how this staff had their hands tied/handcuffed? What were they not afforded that they so desperately needed to change their outcome????

 

If you can't read my posts without comprehending it or without attacking every word I say, I wish you would block me. There is no use in talking to you. Everyone on every thread we've had this discussion has stated they we are both correct and incorrect on some of the things we state. Yet you want to paint me as the evil gamemaster while you are the great white light of reason.

 

You may want to clean your palate so you can kiss the new coach's tail. Because Richters is gone....and it would be great if you went with him IMHO.

[Mavchamp]

 

LOL. RIGHT!!!

 

I promise you....he's all indignant because he's the SPORTSTUD...he knows all and he knows best.

 

Little does he realize how ridiculous he comes across.

 

He should go cover Pine Tree or Nacogdoches if he wants to cover teams that hang their hats on moral victories. I'm sure the fine people of those newspapers would love his fluff.

[JTFAN99]

 

But.....Marshall has had inexperienced teams before. We've had youthful teams before. We've had to rebuild before. And we've had talent droughts too (late 90's).

 

 

those late 90's teams with Kendrick Starling, Paul Todd, and etc were outstanding. If those teams were a drop off in talent, then that is amazing. Kendrick Starling is one of the best players that I have seen in East Texas. His game against Longview in 98 was an unbelievable performance. And 98 was the yr JT won the district. JT only lost was to Marshall, and it was ugly. something like 38-14. Starling was unbelievable. Coach Harper and those Fade Routes.

 

But I get your larger point. lol

[Mavchamp]

those late 90's teams with Kendrick Starling, Paul Todd, and etc were outstanding. If those teams were a drop off in talent, then that is amazing. Kendrick Starling is one of the best players that I have seen in East Texas. His game against Longview in 98 was an unbelievable performance. And 98 was the yr JT won the district. JT only lost was to Marshall, and it was ugly. something like 38-14. Starling was unbelievable. Coach Harper and those Fade Routes.

 

But I get your larger point. lol

 

1997 was 5-5.

1999 was 4-6.

 

1998 was killer. We were in the state's AP poll (#14 or so I think) and sat at home with a (7-3) record. A 15-10 loss to Lufkin in week ten kept us at home.

 

1998 was the year that Marshall, Longview, Lee, and JT were ALL in the top ten at one point or another. Longview and Marshall were both #1 on different polls when they played....Marshall won in 2OT. And NEITHER OF US MADE THE PLAYOFFS.

 

I remember going to Rose Stadium the Saturday after Marshall had lost to Lufkin. All we needed was for Tyler Lee to win and Marshall would have been in. But JT won and Marshall's fate was sealed. Sat at home with a (7-3) record. I was sick about it.

 

Those were some FUN FUN times when literally ANYONE in the district could have been district champs. There was never a clean cut favorite like there always seems to be lately.

[LoboFan07]

Those were some FUN FUN times when literally ANYONE in the district could have been district champs. There was never a clean cut favorite like there always seems to be lately.

The blow outs that would happen this year if that district were still together...holy Jesus. :mellow: :mellow: :mellow:

[sportsstud]

Mavchamp, you might want to look at who started this thread, and if you have a problem w/ it, you might want to take your bad, hypocritical attitude elsewhere! I'm not going anywhere, so you might as well get used to having other opinions which are stuck w/ and not yours which are wishy washy in nature.

[LoboFan07]

Mavchamp, you might want to look at who started this thread, and if you have a problem w/ it, you might want to take your bad, hypocritical attitude elsewhere! I'm not going anywhere, so you might as well get used to having other opinions which are stuck w/ and not yours which are wishy washy in nature.

 

May I ask how many games you have actually attended? Did you go to all 10 this season? How bout last season? How about all the games in the past 20 years?

 

Mavchamp actually backs up his opinion with facts that have led him to that opinion. He wants nothing more than for Marshall to get back on top, while you are just sitting there happy with a 3-17 record in the past two seasons.

[sportsstud]

Lobofan, when was there ever anything said in this space saying I or anyone in here was happy about anything? I don't get happy and sad w/ football games, as they don't run my life to be frank w/ you. I even commended the guy for his research. You might want to go back and research yourself on what I've said and haven't said.

[Coach Rab]

Mavchamp and Mavgrad unfortunately speak out of both sides of their mouth and will bully you if you don't agree with their philosophy. Understand this, what happened yesterday happened, and my life moves on with the decision. What I find fascinating is how you call this a junior varsity roster which not only is insulting to the kids you claim to "care so much about," but it also goes back to how terrible you and others feel this coach and staff were. Were they great? No, Did they get the job done? No, Were their hands severely tied or handcuffed behind their backs, heck yeahI love how you're telling everyone in here how the roster was of a junior varsity level, yet when someone else says the talent is down you throw a hissy fit and you talk about all the All-Stars this team had. Mavsgrad talks about how the talent is still there but now brings up grades, injuries and a lack of depth, yet when someone else brings those things up in the regular season he/she is branded as an evil person who is doing nothing but trying to bring the kids down. Best of luck to Richters the young men and the new athletic/director and coaching staff, but please stop the insanity!

 

I will refrain from insults to you since you do a pretty good job of insulting your self. I will save those for the college forums. However, I never once said this team should be winning this year. I said last year many of us thought they should compete for the district. Obviously, that didnt happen. I did not say they would win this year if they could keep grades up and people healthy. I did say that when the team has the talent, that is the most difficult task. I do not have a philosophy. I do not coach. I am a spectator from Atlanta, GA that worked with Richters and many of his coaches. I expected him to come in and not only clean up some of bad academics and attitude problems, but to continue a winning tradition. Sure, he got screwed over by being tossed into a HC position in which he may not have wanted on those terms. The facts still remain, which was his record and ultimately the outcry from people who showed their lack of support for him within the city.

 

And by the way, you speak as if I bashed Marshall all season. This is my 5th post this year in the Marshall threads since I am no longer able to adequately follow the Mavs. The 4 previous ones were all positive. This one is more negative because I feel like I have to speak down to your ignorance and lack of "read and comprehension".

 

Have a good day troll. I have already gave my best wishes to the Marshall Mavericks and Coach Richters this year.

[Coach Rab]

1997 was 5-5.

1999 was 4-6.

 

1998 was killer. We were in the state's AP poll (#14 or so I think) and sat at home with a (7-3) record. A 15-10 loss to Lufkin in week ten kept us at home.

 

1998 was the year that Marshall, Longview, Lee, and JT were ALL in the top ten at one point or another. Longview and Marshall were both #1 on different polls when they played....Marshall won in 2OT. And NEITHER OF US MADE THE PLAYOFFS.

 

I remember going to Rose Stadium the Saturday after Marshall had lost to Lufkin. All we needed was for Tyler Lee to win and Marshall would have been in. But JT won and Marshall's fate was sealed. Sat at home with a (7-3) record. I was sick about it.

 

Those were some FUN FUN times when literally ANYONE in the district could have been district champs. There was never a clean cut favorite like there always seems to be lately.

 

That was also the year we beat 3 schools ranked #1 in the state of Texas and lost to Evangel by 2 really late TDs in the swampfest that was the Independence Bowl.

 

The late TD pass to Kendrick Starling that was called incomplete sealed our fate against Lufkin.

[Coach Rab]

May I ask how many games you have actually attended? Did you go to all 10 this season? How bout last season? How about all the games in the past 20 years?

 

Mavchamp actually backs up his opinion with facts that have led him to that opinion. He wants nothing more than for Marshall to get back on top, while you are just sitting there happy with a 3-17 record in the past two seasons.

 

He appears to be a disgruntled coach looking for new jobs because he now knows his is in jeopardy? I mean if I am going to talk out of both sides of my mouth and all, I should state opinions and perception as well.

[sportsstud]

Actually, it's more like putting words in my mouth mavgrad99. I would've supported the decision either way, as unlike you, I don't have a dog in this fight (not saying you shouldn't if you went there). As a matter of fact, the word "win" was never even written once in the post I wrote, so when did I say you said they would win this year if they could keep grades up and people healthy? I think your lack of "reading comprehension" (not read and comprehension for starters) needs a lot of work actually. Also, where did I say the outcry from people wasn't OK? Please show it to me. They can have their opinion, you can have yours and I can have mine. We can all agree to disagree and still move forward. Have a great day.

[Coach Rab]

Champ, can you PM me and clean your inbox. I have a.quick question I would like to ask you.

[Mavchamp]

where did I say the outcry from people wasn't OK? Please show it to me.

 

You have spent all season long trolling two different forums calling people names for the "outcry".

 

Anytime anyone even HINTED that a change may be needed you went all-out, guns blazing attack mode on them.

 

 

http://pub8.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=665434181&frmid=7952&msgid=919425&cmd=show&cp=1

 

There is a thread three pages long of you ('Reality Pill' and 'Laughs') name calling, attacking, and insulting people for having a different opinion that you have.

 

So don't act like you have had one ounce tolerance for people that wanted change.

 

Maybe we should pull up some of your SDC posts of you attacking anyone wanting change.

 

No need really. You've already got 3-4 on this thread alone.

 

Everyone sees right through your pseudo sports intellect.

[Mavchamp]

Mavchamp, you might want to look at who started this thread, and if you have a problem w/ it, you might want to take your bad, hypocritical attitude elsewhere! I'm not going anywhere, so you might as well get used to having other opinions which are stuck w/ and not yours which are wishy washy in nature.

 

Bad attitude????

Explain how I have a bad attitude. Bad meaning I think that 3-17 isn't good enough to keep around? Then yes. So explain how I have a bad attitude.

 

Hypocritical???

Again.....explain. How have I been a hypocrite? I want an example. Not just general statements. If you mean not agreeing with you, then yes.

 

And I have no problem with people with other opinions. You are the one that attacks anyone that doesn't want to crown this staff with Coach of the year awards.

 

Wishy washy????

Explain? I think I've been pretty vocal and dead on from the beginning about how I feel.

 

And apparently there are many that agree.

 

Calling us insane, hypocritical, and letting the prisoners run the prison is hardly the words of a man that open to differing opinions.

 

You are condescending, rude, and close-minded. And I think everyone that reads your posts on SDC or on any other forum can see straight through the baloney you are disseminating.

 

Keep talking. You look more foolish with every post you make.....

[Mavo]

MavChamp is right on the money. Nobody is assaulting Coach Richters or saying that he is a bad guy. He is a good man with great intentions. But for whatever reason, it didn't work for him as the head man in Marshall. His teams were abyssmal. We couldn't tackle. We had to call a time out on the first play of the season because we couldn't get lined up correctly and this happened for the past two years. In the last game of the season, we failed to field a kickoff, resulting in a turnover. This happened at least four times this year, and for whatever reason, was never fixed. Our practices were similar to attending a wake. We looked confused and out of sorts all the time. We would change offensive philosophies from series to series. There was nothing about this situation that appeared like it would get any better if Coach Richters received another year. Quite frankly, I believe the situation would have worsened. The kids and the community had lost faith in this staff. Sometimes, coaching staffs just don't fit. This is one of those examples.

 

I also believe Smoaky is way off base in his statement that this reassignment is a great deal of turnover. Coach Harris and Coach Richters were both part of the Southern staff. That staff, in some form or fashion, has been in Marshall for ten years. We have hired our last two coaches from within that original staff. That is not coaching turnover, but an attempt to continue the successes of the Southern regime. Coach Harris would likely still be employed but for some off field issues. Nobody could have foreseen that Coach Richters' program would be in this position at the end of the 2012 season. It is the job of MISD to hire the best and most qualified individuals for each position so as to provide kids the opportunities to succeed. Success was not going to come under this regime, for whatever reason.

 

I wish Coach Richters nothing but the best. He is a good football coach and a better man. It just didn't work out in Marshall. I hope he finds success at his next stop. I don't believe this will be his last head coaching gig.