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Greatest EAST Texas Rivalry?


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Back in the day Atlanta and LK was a big deal.

That’s not a perception it is the reality.  Carthage has been one of the 5 or so best programs in the state of any class and division this last decade or so.  But it’s that one reality that also cause

Daingerfield’s Coaching Staff vs the DMV

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22 hours ago, Mavchamp said:

Texas High has dominated Arkansas High for the better part of two decades...!or more. It’s in about the same boat as Lufkin/Nac and Marshall/Longview. 

The Lee/JT series is interesting.  I’m willing to bet JT dominates the overall series. But Lee... as awful as they have been for over 10+ years, has still managed to be a thorn in JT’s side. 

Definitely one of the better rivalries in East Texas. 

good points.   

You have rivalries because of proximity like Lufkin vs Nac

You have others because they are current or former district opponents that are always playing for something significant like district champ or they meet nearly annually in playoffs or in preaseason like .Longview vs Lufkin

But then you have JT vs Lee.  This rivalry kinda mirrors social,  demographic, and economic issues in America.  Honestly the game is secondary. Beating Lee to most JT fans is more than just winning on the scoreboard.  That why i think its an underrated rivalry. 

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1 hour ago, JTFAN99 said:

good points.   

You have rivalries because of proximity like Lufkin vs Nac

You have others because they are current or former district opponents that are always playing for something significant like district champ or they meet nearly annually in playoffs or in preaseason like .Longview vs Lufkin

But then you have JT vs Lee.  This rivalry kinda mirrors social,  demographic, and economic issues in America.  Honestly the game is secondary. Beating Lee to most JT fans is more than just winning on the scoreboard.  That why i think its an underrated rivalry. 

Lee social status is not what it use to be. Tisd for that matter. 

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On 5/12/2020 at 6:15 AM, Raiderfan7000 said:

Perception is different. Henderson hasn’t been competitive against them in quite a while.( Not scoring points is difficult to do ). I could be wrong but looks like Henderson ran away from Carthage in the schedule. Right now it two teams that just don’t like each other. Then again I bet many Longview and lufkin fans wished Marshall/ Nac took the Henderson approach.

That’s not a perception it is the reality.  Carthage has been one of the 5 or so best programs in the state of any class and division this last decade or so.  But it’s that one reality that also causes the perception of Henderson to be a lot less than it should be overall.  Henderson is one of the top 5 or so programs of any class and division in East Texas the last decade also.   But not many people would automatically think that without looking at the numbers because of one of their 2 main rivals havinyg the ridiculous resume that Carthage does.  I would have answered the phone and scheduled the non-district game for the next 2 years just so not to hear it from anybody.  But there was a couple years off in like 2012-2013 or so and doing that again now is fine too.  They won’t be not playing each other for long.  And hopefully more points and wins for Henderson when they do.  It’s a lot more fun and interesting when it’s more competitive.  
 

On the last day of the decade, Hayden Henry from the Longview paper sent the tweet below about Carthage, Gilmer, and Longview being the teams/programs of the decade for East Texas.  
 

Here’s a little more detail about those 3 for the decade that just ended and how Henderson compares ... obviously worse but not by much.  It shows each team’s record by year.  In parentheses are games vs Henderson.  Carthage and Henderson played 2x several seasons and Gilmer and Henderson did in 2012.  Henderson was a combined 2-13 vs those 2 in the 2010s.  But very good against everyone else and in the playoffs.  13 of Henderson’s 37 losses overall and 4 of Henderson’s 7 playoff game losses for the decade were to Carthage and Gilmer.  Henderson lost 24 games overall and 3 playoff games in 10 years to everybody else. 

Another interesting thing is Henderson went to at least the quarterfinals/regional finals/4th round 7 times in 10 seasons last decade.  They only went further twice ... 2010 and 2011.  They won state in 2010.  The other six times the team that put Henderson out of the playoffs went to the championship game every time but 2018 Carthage.  Navasota 14, Carthage 16, and Carthage 17 won state.  The rest of them were 2nd.  The interesting part is to think how many times Henderson most likely would have won or at least gone to the championship game with the current class and divisions.  Because of those other six years the only one Henderson could possibly play now is 2011 Alvarado.  All the others (Gilmer 12, Navasota 14, and Carthage 16/17/18) are no longer possible playoff opponents at least currently.

2010s Decade

Carthage 

14-2.  6-0.  (W 43-33)

9-4.  2-1.   (W 42-21)

11-3.   3-1.

14-1.   5-0.

6-6.  1-1.  (L 38-16)

11-4.   4-1.  (W 35-15)

13-2.  6-0.  (L 28-36; W 33-31)

16-0.  6-0.  (W 42-17;  W 35-0)

14-1.  4-1.   (W 34-0;  W 28-7)

16-0.  6-0.  (W 34-14)

— Played 148 total games / 48 playoff games 

125-23  (.844); 43-5 (.896)

(8-2 vs Hendo)

— 7 district championships 

2010, 2012, 2013, 2014t, 2016, 2018, 2019

— 5 state championships 

2010, 2013, 2016, 2017, 2019

 

Gilmer 

9-4.  2-1.  (W 29-28)

13-1.  3-1.  (W 35-20)

14-2.  5-1.  (W 28-26; W 41-34)

11-2.  2-1.  (W 64-7)

16-0.  6-0.  

14-1.  5-1.

13-2.  4-1. 

10-3.  2-1.

6-7.  2–1. 

11-4. 3-1.   

— Played 143 total games / 43 playoff games 

117-26 (.818); 34-9 ( .791)

(5-0 vs Hendo)
 

— 5 district championships 

2011, 2012, 2014, 2015, 2016

— 1 state championship 

2014

 

 

Longview 

10-5.  4-1.

11-2.  2-1.

9-4.  2-1.

11-2.  2-1.

9-3.  1-1.

11-3.  3-1.

8-3.  0-1.

13-2.  4-1.

16-0.  6-0.

11-1.   1-1. 

109-25.  25-9.

— Played 134 total games / 34 playoff games 

109-25 (.813);  25-9 (.735)

— 8 district championships 

2010t, 2011, 2013, 2014, 2015t, 2016t, 2018, 2019

— 1 state championship 

2018
 

Henderson

13-2.  5-0.

11-3.    3-1.

9-5.   3-1.

3-7.    0-0.

11-3.  3-1.

7-3.   0-0.

11-2.  2-1.

11-3.  3-1.

9-5.  3-1.

7-4.   0-1.

92-37.  22-7.

— Played 129 total games / 29 playoff games.

— 92-37 (.713); 22-7 (.759)

— 2 district championships  

2014t, 2016t

— 1 state championship

2010

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On 5/12/2020 at 5:42 PM, Mavchamp said:

Texas High has dominated Arkansas High for the better part of two decades...!or more. It’s in about the same boat as Lufkin/Nac and Marshall/Longview. 

The Lee/JT series is interesting.  I’m willing to bet JT dominates the overall series. But Lee... as awful as they have been for over 10+ years, has still managed to be a thorn in JT’s side. 

Definitely one of the better rivalries in East Texas. 

For what it's worth, JT only leads REL 33-30-1. It's crazy to me how close that series is with how bad Lee has been through out its history and how good JT has been in that same time frame.

Series was dead even at 5-5 in the 2010s, which is just absolutely ridiculous to me.

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11 minutes ago, LoboFan07 said:

For what it's worth, JT only leads REL 33-30-1. It's crazy to me how close that series is with how bad Lee has been through out its history and how good JT has been in that same time frame.

Series was dead even at 5-5 in the 2010s, which is just absolutely ridiculous to me.

That shocks me.

I knew Lee had been a thorn in their side for the last decade and a half or so... but I figured JT dominated otherwise.

Interesting  
 

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It’s been said the lufkin Nac game is only played because of distance. It’s close for both teams. I’m pretty sure both teams can find another opponent. I remember back in the day when we used to play Bryant and Beaumont Westbrook. Not saying it has to be one of those but I’m sure we could find another game. 

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23 hours ago, Mavchamp said:

That shocks me.

I knew Lee had been a thorn in their side for the last decade and a half or so... but I figured JT dominated otherwise.

Interesting  
 

When you have a crosstown rivalry, you can throw everything out the window.  Many of these kids are relatives or good friends and have been playing against each other since they were little kids.  Because of that you get to know the each other tendencies.   

However, the only thing that is crazy about this rivalry is that other than 2013, I can't think of another time in the past 20 years that JT was the underdog and they beat Lee.  

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On 5/17/2020 at 4:20 PM, LoboFan07 said:

For what it's worth, JT only leads REL 33-30-1. It's crazy to me how close that series is with how bad Lee has been through out its history and how good JT has been in that same time frame.

Series was dead even at 5-5 in the 2010s, which is just absolutely ridiculous to me.

JT and lee have had times where they both had dominated the series. JT in the 90’s and after 98 JT didn’t beat Lee again until 2010. In those years Lee was able to close the gap. That was the year that Lee would have pulled even with JT. 

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4 hours ago, cujoforlife said:

JT and lee have had times where they both had dominated the series. JT in the 90’s and after 98 JT didn’t beat Lee again until 2010. In those years Lee was able to close the gap. That was the year that Lee would have pulled even with JT. 

after 98, JT next win against LEE was in 2005, then again in 2010

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5 hours ago, JTFAN99 said:

after 98, JT next win against LEE was in 2005, then again in 2010

That was when coach Thomas brooks was there right, in 2005? I was living in Wisconsin at the  time. 

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On 4/24/2020 at 3:41 PM, Eagle8 said:

Tatum and SH were rivals in the 90s. Not so much now. We ain't really had a rival since the 2000s. We had a nice little rivalry going with Carthage before Surratt showed up lol. Before we got turf they came and painted a red CHS on our 50 and spread bird seeds all over the home bleachers. Then we beat them 17-0 with Stephen Hodge. We traded wins for a bit for about 6 or so games. But now, we don't exactly have a rival anymore. 

Spring Hill and Tatum have had a rivalry that goes back to the 70's and 80's! 

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17 hours ago, Panther89 said:

Spring Hill and Tatum have had a rivalry that goes back to the 70's and 80's! 

Goes back to the early 60s. 

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On ‎5‎/‎6‎/‎2020 at 7:44 AM, blackflag79 said:

I certainly miss those days when everybody was good, and the winner would most likely be in the finals, if not a state champion.  Every game was a sell out, and it was what Friday Nights in East Texas was all about.  I wish we could get that mojo back.

What years are you thinking of?

 

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On ‎5‎/‎12‎/‎2020 at 5:42 PM, Mavchamp said:

Texas High has dominated Arkansas High for the better part of two decades...!or more. It’s in about the same boat as Lufkin/Nac and Marshall/Longview. 

The Lee/JT series is interesting.  I’m willing to bet JT dominates the overall series. But Lee... as awful as they have been for over 10+ years, has still managed to be a thorn in JT’s side. 

Definitely one of the better rivalries in East Texas. 

I'm a Texas High grad from long ago and have been away from there since shortly after high school.  The rivalry with Arkansas High was about as big as one could imagine at that time.  I'd be interested in hearing from someone still in that area... do the T-High folks still think of this like they did in days gone by, or has it lost its luster with how lopsided it is?

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4 hours ago, Everide2016 said:

I'm a Texas High grad from long ago and have been away from there since shortly after high school.  The rivalry with Arkansas High was about as big as one could imagine at that time.  I'd be interested in hearing from someone still in that area... do the T-High folks still think of this like they did in days gone by, or has it lost its luster with how lopsided it is?

I would say it has lost it's luster.  The size disparity between the two schools is quite large right now.  Texas High should never really lose to Arkansas High any more with the number of athletes the two schools have to choose from.  It's still a big game and well supported but nothing near like it was when the schools were close to the same size.

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On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2020 at 6:11 PM, unclebubba said:

I would say it has lost it's luster.  The size disparity between the two schools is quite large right now.  Texas High should never really lose to Arkansas High any more with the number of athletes the two schools have to choose from.  It's still a big game and well supported but nothing near like it was when the schools were close to the same size.

Has Texas High grown a lot, or Arkansas High shrunk?  I'm completely out of touch.

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On 5/27/2020 at 2:02 PM, Everide2016 said:

I'm a Texas High grad from long ago and have been away from there since shortly after high school.  The rivalry with Arkansas High was about as big as one could imagine at that time.  I'd be interested in hearing from someone still in that area... do the T-High folks still think of this like they did in days gone by, or has it lost its luster with how lopsided it is?

It is still a huge rivalry despite the lopsided number of wins in recent years by T-High. Arkansas High would be a large 4A in Texas, while Texas High is midsized 5A school. Texas High is almost twice the size of Arkansas High. Bedlam in the city is more sedate than in the past. However it is not a rivalry of two schools, it is a rivalry of two states represented in their school names. In recent years, the move of Barry Norton to Arkansas High has given the game some additional emphasis.

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