Trump issues sweeping order stripping job protections from tens of thousands of federal employees

[RETIREDFAN1]

https://www.stripes.com/trump-issues-sweeping-order-stripping-job-protections-from-tens-of-thousands-of-federal-employees-1.649559?utm_source=wnd&utm_medium=wnd&utm_campaign=syndicated

[Olduy]

About time!

 

[BarryLaverty]

1 minute ago, Olduy said:

About time!

 

Why is it about time? This is about putting loyalty tests in place, not looking at competence. 

[DAWG91]

Drain that sucker!

[BarryLaverty]

3 minutes ago, DAWG91 said:

Drain that sucker!

He's done ZIP draining. Instead he has loaded up on his minions and his people, regardless of their actual qualifications to do the job they receive. Why is that a good thing? 

[TTman7]

Heck yea!! Long overdue! 

[trashyhound]

38 minutes ago, BarryLaverty said:

He's done ZIP draining. Instead he has loaded up on his minions and his people, regardless of their actual qualifications to do the job they receive. Why is that a good thing? 

Sounds like public schools to me.....

[Olduy]

1 hour ago, BarryLaverty said:

Why is it about time? This is about putting loyalty tests in place, not looking at competence. 

If, a big if, they were competent.

if you have ever dealt with the Federal government bureaucrats you might come to the realization that most are not!
 

Does not have anything to do with loyalties. But a leader should be able to put people in place that share the same ideals.

 

[KirtFalcon]

Unfortunately there are many thousands of career civil service political swamp dwellers that permeate the federal government ... I saw a lot of them during my military career .... and I only saw the tip of the iceberg .... there needs to be a better system of checks and balances to root them out .... I would equate the problem with trying to eradicate ferrel hogs in East Texas ....

[DannyZuco]

3 hours ago, BarryLaverty said:

Why is it about time? This is about putting loyalty tests in place, not looking at competence. 

If you read the entire article, you would know that "Trump's new order closely follows issuance of rules telling agencies to provide only the minimal accommodations required by law to assist under performing employees before disciplining them and to make the maximum use of their discretion in choosing discipline either for poor performance or misconduct."

To me that sounds like it is a way to get rid of employees that take there government job for granted, and we the American taxpayer are supporting, even when they do a terrible job--like the postal service, and the IRS. We need more people actually working in national parks, and the military, as soldiers, not all those "paper pushers". 

That is the one thing that Bill Clinton did that actually allowed the US to have a budget surplus for a couple of years--he did not re-hire jobs when people retired and cut the federal government payroll by over 100,000 jobs. 

And you, Barry, know as well as I do--it's hard to get rid of those people who don't do their jobs to their best abilities, especially in government work. As teachers, we see this year in and year out--some keeps their job when they do the least amount of work. 

[BarryLaverty]

2 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

If you read the entire article, you would know that "Trump's new order closely follows issuance of rules telling agencies to provide only the minimal accommodations required by law to assist under performing employees before disciplining them and to make the maximum use of their discretion in choosing discipline either for poor performance or misconduct."

To me that sounds like it is a way to get rid of employees that take there government job for granted, and we the American taxpayer are supporting, even when they do a terrible job--like the postal service, and the IRS. We need more people actually working in national parks, and the military, as soldiers, not all those "paper pushers". 

That is the one thing that Bill Clinton did that actually allowed the US to have a budget surplus for a couple of years--he did not re-hire jobs when people retired and cut the federal government payroll by over 100,000 jobs. 

And you, Barry, know as well as I do--it's hard to get rid of those people who don't do their jobs to their best abilities, especially in government work. As teachers, we see this year in and year out--some keeps their job when they do the least amount of work. 

You have been doing this long enough to remember when the big move against coaches was to eliminate rollover contracts, as I was told, to ' make it easier' for coaches to leave when they wanted, when really it was to strip away procedures and due process that kept personal feelings out of it. This is what this is. 

[DannyZuco]

3 minutes ago, BarryLaverty said:

You have been doing this long enough to remember when the big move against coaches was to eliminate rollover contracts, as I was told, to ' make it easier' for coaches to leave when they wanted, when really it was to strip away procedures and due process that kept personal feelings out of it. This is what this is. 

And I can promise you, some coaches needed to have their contracts non-renewed. But what coach would not get his contract non-renewed if he was doing everything the "RIGHT" way? Well I know 1 for sure--still has the paperwork to prove everything he did was following state and UIL rules, but still got non-renewed because of one lousy parent who convinced a school board that he knew more about athletics than a seasoned veteran teacher and coach--and the was a freaking auto mechanic for the border patrol. But at the same time, I know lots of coaches, that need to do more work for the pay they receive. Again, if we are getting rid of people who are NOT doing their job correctly--then I DO NOT have a problem with this. Especially since I am helping pay those individuals. 

[BarryLaverty]

3 hours ago, DannyZuco said:

And I can promise you, some coaches needed to have their contracts non-renewed. But what coach would not get his contract non-renewed if he was doing everything the "RIGHT" way? Well I know 1 for sure--still has the paperwork to prove everything he did was following state and UIL rules, but still got non-renewed because of one lousy parent who convinced a school board that he knew more about athletics than a seasoned veteran teacher and coach--and the was a freaking auto mechanic for the border patrol. But at the same time, I know lots of coaches, that need to do more work for the pay they receive. Again, if we are getting rid of people who are NOT doing their job correctly--then I DO NOT have a problem with this. Especially since I am helping pay those individuals. 

You got it right through your first story, in that this sets up people to be fired for no reason other than 'disloyalty' not performance. 

[Youngcoach123]

4 hours ago, BarryLaverty said:

You got it right through your first story, in that this sets up people to be fired for no reason other than 'disloyalty' not performance. 

Better that than forever having a job with no loyalty. At least loyalty to current admin (dem or repub) means the are beholden somewhat to the people and voters.

[trashyhound]

7 hours ago, BarryLaverty said:

You got it right through your first story, in that this sets up people to be fired for no reason other than 'disloyalty' not performance. 

Then they could file a lawsuit correct? Then all these hard workers could stand in front of a judge and make a claim about wrongful termination. So you'd rather they be untouchable regardless of performance?

[BarryLaverty]

3 hours ago, Youngcoach123 said:

Better that than forever having a job with no loyalty. At least loyalty to current admin (dem or repub) means the are beholden somewhat to the people and voters.

How about being 'loyal' to the idea of being in government service, not bound by party? 

34 minutes ago, trashyhound said:

Then they could file a lawsuit correct? Then all these hard workers could stand in front of a judge and make a claim about wrongful termination. So you'd rather they be untouchable regardless of performance?

No one has been 'untouchable', but there has been due process and appropriate procedures in place. This strips much of that away is my understanding. 
 

Is that we want? People having to learn their jobs every time an administration changes? These are not political jobs but jobs that require competence and service.

[Youngcoach123]

1 hour ago, BarryLaverty said:

How about being 'loyal' to the idea of being in government service, not bound by party? 

Any accountability is better than none. If each different party fired everyone in the gov and started over, that would be better than the current system

[KirtFalcon]

I know first hand what it's like to TRY to get rid of career civil service dead weight people doing more harm than good. I had about 4 or 5 out of over 150 civil service employees working  in Logistics out at Barksdale AFB in the 90s that really needed to be fired, it was next to impossible to do anything about them.  Short of them putting their, or someone else's life in danger, they were practically untouchable.  About all you can do in most cases is try and reassign them, but that just shifts the problem to another area .... 

Mr Pardee, one of my logistics analysts, said to me once, pointing at an ICBM static display on the base, "You see that right there?  That's the symbol of the civil service worker. It sits there and does nothing and you can't fire it" .....

Edited October 27, 2020 by KirtFalcon
yo mama

[TheShadowKnows]

if people could, they would not be in government. 

[KirtFalcon]

35 minutes ago, TheShadowKnows said:

if people could, they would not be in government. 

There is not a lot of incentive to produce for many of the bad apples .... they basically coast, some barely pulling their weight, a few actively pulling against the stated goals .... I dealt with a lot of lower to mid level people, naturally,  President Trump's problem goes to the higher and highest levels of government where the difficulties of dealing with these people are substantially compounded .... guys like Lt Col Vindman, Strzok,  McCabe .... the swamp is deep and wide .....

Edited October 27, 2020 by KirtFalcon
yo mama