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To Mask or Not To Mask Question Answered Differently In One Town With Two School Districts


BarryLaverty

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22 hours ago, trashyhound said:

Ok, let’s move past your tax problem for a second. Just to be clear i understand the taxes 100%, but I’m trying to look forward to a better system and not focus what we gave today. 
 

Philanthropist Jett gives the state of Texas an infinite amount of money but it’s earmarked for public education.
 

Would you be in favor of each child in Texas being allowed to choose their school and their money from the state going with them? 

See, it's the last sentence I have with your question. Student's do NOT have money from the state, unless they attend an Independent School District! While in a perfect world, having someone leave an infinite amount of money would be more than wonderful--it will never happen. And if the Jettster were to leave that much money--then there wouldn't be a need for local ISD property taxes--which costs all the Texas property owners--more than any other property tax. So if there were NO property taxes--then students could go to any school they want to, as long as all schools were all held to the same standards of accountability. 

I will say it one more time--Students Have School Choice NOW!!!! So without local property tax dollars, what ever the Jettster sets up would be okay with me. And I still believe in school choice, always have always will, but I don't believe that LOCAL property tax funds should leave their locality. 

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So let's do some math for you gentlemen. Because we all love math. 

One of our gentlemen said you should get what you pay in property taxes for your child to use as a voucher. 

Here is the number for your median (average) homes in Texas-If you home is $250K--then you would pay over $4500 dollars in Local property taxes. 

The median property tax in Texas is $2,275.00 per year for a home worth the median value of $125,800.00. Counties in Texas collect an average of 1.81% of a property's assessed fair market value as property tax per year.

So lets say we all agree that this is what you get to move your child to ANY school district in Texas. Now several other problems start to occur. 

1. Those good public schools get over crowded--are you all going to allow them to have enrollment cutoffs, or are you going to complain that they have to take your child? 

2. Private schools have limited enrollment, which will make it harder for you to find that perfect little private school that will attend to all the needs of your child. At the same time, https://www.privateschoolreview.com/tuition-stats/texas   The average private school tuition in Texas is approximately $9,827 per year (2021). The private elementary school average is $8,097 per year and the private high school average is $11,389 per year. The private school with the lowest tuition is Chinquapin Preparatory School, with a tuition of $1,170.

3. You only get your property tax money--so that is about 1/2 or 1/3 the cost of a private school. So now what do you do? 

4. What you might find out is that Public school districts will take your child, for a fee, and I know some do this for "out of district" students. I did it for 2 years for my oldest daughter. Because she had attended one school her entire middle school and high school career, and the district where we moved, did not have a band program which she loved. So we had to pay to keep her in the old district, and to top it off, it was closer to our new home than the schools for the school district we moved into. 

5. What if the "fee" is the cost of educating your child in the state of Texas. 

The bottom line: The TEA says Texas spent $9,150 per student for the 2016 fiscal year — a slight increase from the year prior when Texas spent $8,937 per student. The NEA says Texas spent $10,456 per student for the 2017-18 school year — a number $2,300 below the national average.

These are the latest number I can find. So, there you get your up to $4500 dollar and now you get to go to a "better" public school, at double the cost of your "free" public school and ISD, where you live. 

6. Maybe we all should find ways to make our OWN ISDs a better education center. Become school board members, attend school board meetings to understand where the money goes. Why is there so much turnover in some districts? How do those "good" districts keep the good teachers and become "good"? How can the community help the education system where you live? Does your school district expect every kid to go to college? Do they have training programs for jobs right out of high school? Are there industries in your area that can provide internships to students? 

 

 

 

 

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43 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

See, it's the last sentence I have with your question. Student's do NOT have money from the state, unless they attend an Independent School District! While in a perfect world, having someone leave an infinite amount of money would be more than wonderful--it will never happen. And if the Jettster were to leave that much money--then there wouldn't be a need for local ISD property taxes--which costs all the Texas property owners--more than any other property tax. So if there were NO property taxes--then students could go to any school they want to, as long as all schools were all held to the same standards of accountability. 

I will say it one more time--Students Have School Choice NOW!!!! So without local property tax dollars, what ever the Jettster sets up would be okay with me. And I still believe in school choice, always have always will, but I don't believe that LOCAL property tax funds should leave their locality. 

Ok, i understand you have an issue with the financing. But if the financing is worked out why make all schools meet the same criteria? 
how well has that worked for our schools currently? 

Why can’t parents decide which school is performing up to their standards? 
I think the one school fits all model is an epic failure. 

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Just now, trashyhound said:

Ok, i understand you have an issue with the financing. But if the financing is worked out why make all schools meet the same criteria? 
how well has that worked for our schools currently? 

Why can’t parents decide which school is performing up to their standards? 
I think the one school fits all model is an epic failure. 

Because if you don't have standards/accountability--how do you know if someone is educated? I am not saying that the STAAR testing is the way to go--lord knows I hate these tests--it's just a way to get money into the hands of politicians. But all students must be held to some sort of accountability--so that we know your little johnny can read, write, and do basic math at the end of the day. 

Heck, I would even be in favor of those racist SATs and ACTs as the measuring stick for graduation, but that won't happen, I can promise you that, because https://tea.texas.gov/sites/default/files/8 Cost Savings for Online Testing.pdf

That $40 million dollars a year is a small figure for those tests, all you have to do is follow the money to see it leads right back to the Texas Legislature. 

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1 hour ago, DannyZuco said:

Because if you don't have standards/accountability--how do you know if someone is educated? I am not saying that the STAAR testing is the way to go--lord knows I hate these tests--it's just a way to get money into the hands of politicians. But all students must be held to some sort of accountability--so that we know your little johnny can read, write, and do basic math at the end of the day. 

Heck, I would even be in favor of those racist SATs and ACTs as the measuring stick for graduation, but that won't happen, I can promise you that, because https://tea.texas.gov/sites/default/files/8 Cost Savings for Online Testing.pdf

That $40 million dollars a year is a small figure for those tests, all you have to do is follow the money to see it leads right back to the Texas Legislature. 

Why can’t the parents grade the school? 
Why does it have to be the loonies in Austin deciding what’s best for our kids? 
I’m perfectly fine with assessment tests. But, let the school choose which test they want to use and if the parents and students don’t like that they can take their vouchers elsewhere. 
I’m also ok for teachers, principals and Supes evaluating those special situations where a kid bombed the STAAR but they determine the kid knows the material so they move them along. 
I for the top of the ladder being a supe and a board not anyone in Austin. 
40 million is not a small figure. It’s another example of waste we get by running our education through the government filter. 

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1 hour ago, trashyhound said:

Why can’t the parents grade the school? 
Why does it have to be the loonies in Austin deciding what’s best for our kids? 

Have you seen some of the parents that send their kids to school. I wouldn't trust any parent, including myself to provide grades to schools. I at least recognize that PO parents will give "f" and those whose darlings are the teachers pets are going to give "A". 

Right now, parents are 1/2 the problem. Overprotecting, overbearing, blame everyone but their student or themselves. I am not saying that Austin is any better, but I would rather have some unbiased people observe schools than parents alone. Parents grading a school district, now that is funny right there, I don't care who you are. If parents want to grade schools, get elected to the school board--then they can grade the entire district, and probably get those they don't like fired. 

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14 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

Have you seen some of the parents that send their kids to school. I wouldn't trust any parent, including myself to provide grades to schools. I at least recognize that PO parents will give "f" and those whose darlings are the teachers pets are going to give "A". 

Right now, parents are 1/2 the problem. Overprotecting, overbearing, blame everyone but their student or themselves. I am not saying that Austin is any better, but I would rather have some unbiased people observe schools than parents alone. Parents grading a school district, now that is funny right there, I don't care who you are. If parents want to grade schools, get elected to the school board--then they can grade the entire district, and probably get those they don't like fired. 

We don't have any of these issues. We home school. We have our own set of challenges, but that's the path we've taken.

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15 minutes ago, Monte1076 said:

We don't have any of these issues. We home school. We have our own set of challenges, but that's the path we've taken.

That's great--looks like you took advantage of the "FREEDOM OF CHOICE"--that is not directed at you, but others on here. LOL. 

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1 hour ago, DannyZuco said:

That's great--looks like you took advantage of the "FREEDOM OF CHOICE"--that is not directed at you, but others on here. LOL. 

Yep, and they should get education funding to spend on it instead of shipping that money to the local isd

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1 hour ago, DannyZuco said:

Have you seen some of the parents that send their kids to school. I wouldn't trust any parent, including myself to provide grades to schools. I at least recognize that PO parents will give "f" and those whose darlings are the teachers pets are going to give "A". 

Right now, parents are 1/2 the problem. Overprotecting, overbearing, blame everyone but their student or themselves. I am not saying that Austin is any better, but I would rather have some unbiased people observe schools than parents alone. Parents grading a school district, now that is funny right there, I don't care who you are. If parents want to grade schools, get elected to the school board--then they can grade the entire district, and probably get those they don't like fired. 

Ok, so you can decide better than parents? 
or politicians can’t do better than parents?

 That’s insane!

 You couldn’t Evaluate the ability of a school that your child is attending? 
C’mon man, you preach on here all the time about not needing the government to hold our hands on everything, but yet you insist not they are the only ones able to grade a school? Seriously?

 What i mean by letting parents and students “grade“ the schools is this. If they have vouchers and are able to go to the school of their choice, they would be voting in a sense with that voucher. Poor schools would dry up and fail and successful schools would flourish. 
 

I understand your complaint about parents but in the course of this discussion you have stated that 1/2 of the parents are the problem and that students are “inmates”. 
Do you find that concerning at all? 

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38 minutes ago, trashyhound said:

Yep, and they should get education funding to spend on it instead of shipping that money to the local isd

We don't. Homeschools in Texas are treated, AFAIK, as Private Schools. We have to pay everything out of pocket. Most of that expense is books and supplies, though.

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18 minutes ago, Monte1076 said:

We don't. Homeschools in Texas are treated, AFAIK, as Private Schools. We have to pay everything out of pocket. Most of that expense is books and supplies, though.

I know y’all don’t, but you should! 
 

Public school monopoly is not gonna give up any of their pipeline without a battle. But it’s coming sooner or later because it’s the right thing to do!

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1 minute ago, trashyhound said:

I know y’all don’t, but you should! 
 

Public school monopoly is not gonna give up any of their pipeline without a battle. But it’s coming sooner or later because it’s the right thing to do!

I am wondering about something, though.

If schools are supposed to get money based upon the number of enrolled students and the time they attend, what happens in my circumstance? They're not getting the money they would normally get for our son, but we're still paying into the pot of money that gets allocated.

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45 minutes ago, Monte1076 said:

I am wondering about something, though.

If schools are supposed to get money based upon the number of enrolled students and the time they attend, what happens in my circumstance? They're not getting the money they would normally get for our son, but we're still paying into the pot of money that gets allocated.

Yep. Taxes are for public school funds, not for the education of our youth. 

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1 hour ago, Monte1076 said:

I am wondering about something, though.

If schools are supposed to get money based upon the number of enrolled students and the time they attend, what happens in my circumstance? They're not getting the money they would normally get for our son, but we're still paying into the pot of money that gets allocated.

Monte--the only money that you are paying into the school district is your property taxes. Maybe in a round about way some of your sales taxes go there also, but that money goes to the general fund, where everybody takes a bite out of it. 

You can claim all your sales taxes each year on your taxes--so that could be a way to recoup your money back. But property taxes are here to stay, whether they go up or down--not a single state doesn't have property taxes.  But again, it was your choice to home school instead of use the public schools in your area. 

Do States with No Property Tax Exist?

Unfortunately, there’s no such thing as states with no property tax. Every state charges real estate property taxes because they are used to fund essential government services like education, infrastructure, law enforcement, public transportation, parks and recreation, as well as water and sewer improvements. However, the phrase is still used by real estate investors to refer to the US states with the lowest property tax rates. In these states, property tax is so small that it’s basically negligible and doesn’t affect positive cash flow and return on investment. Keep in mind, however, that states with the lowest property tax rates might have higher costs elsewhere in order to make up for the costs.

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2 hours ago, trashyhound said:

Ok, so you can decide better than parents? Reading Comprehension--" I wouldn't trust any parent, including myself to provide grades to schools."
or politicians can’t do better than parents? Reading Comprehesion--I am not saying that Austin is any better, 

 That’s insane!

 You couldn’t Evaluate the ability of a school that your child is attending? Yes I could, but I would rip those schools to the bone--because I understand what is going on inside a school district, especially the administration. 
C’mon man, you preach on here all the time about not needing the government to hold our hands on everything, but yet you insist not they are the only ones able to grade a school? Seriously? I am for local control--always have been always will be. That is what school boards are for, at least I thought--to elect officials that would make the schools better for the students. 

 What i mean by letting parents and students “grade“ the schools is this. If they have vouchers and are able to go to the school of their choice, they would be voting in a sense with that voucher. Poor schools would dry up and fail and successful schools would flourish. Yet you never answered any of the other questions from above on how that would really work. What if the other school district doesn't want to take your student--what do you do then--sue? I showed the numbers above, I guess that just doesn't sink in when you think that property taxes are YOUR money. Even Jesus said "pay onto Caesar what is Caesar's"https://biblehub.com/mark/12-17.htm

I understand your complaint about parents but in the course of this discussion you have stated that 1/2 of the parents are the problem and that students are “inmates”. 
Do you find that concerning at all? Nope--because in reality--the "inmates" comment was joking, but a bad one, especially to those "woke" individuals on here. And I placed myself in that parents are 1/2 the problem--as seen above. I could never a grade school fairly and unbiased. You can also read the article I left for Monte--on there are NO states without property taxes. And while vouchers may occur someday, I doubt it will be with LOCAL property tax dollars. But keep believing those politicians that tell you it's bad. I believe that Uncle Joe believes in school choice also--well not him, but his pick for education secretary. https://world.wng.org/content/biden_s_education_department_might_support_school_choice

But then again, students in Texas already have school choice, as do most other states. It just doesn't fit your criteria for allowing you to keep your tax dollars and sending your kid to a private school. 

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4 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

But then again, students in Texas already have school choice, as do most other states. It just doesn't fit your criteria for allowing you to keep your tax dollars and sending your kid to a private school. 

Dude you are dense. 
 

So who decides which schools are making the grade in your dream scenario? you’ve stated not parents, yourself, or politicians.  So please enlighten me as to who you would like to measure the production of schools? 
 

If i hold a weapon to your head and tell you to give me your money, you still technically have a choice but is it really a choice? 
That’s exactly what your school choice pipe dream is like. 

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22 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

Monte--the only money that you are paying into the school district is your property taxes. Maybe in a round about way some of your sales taxes go there also, but that money goes to the general fund, where everybody takes a bite out of it. 

You can claim all your sales taxes each year on your taxes--so that could be a way to recoup your money back. But property taxes are here to stay, whether they go up or down--not a single state doesn't have property taxes.  But again, it was your choice to home school instead of use the public schools in your area. 

Do States with No Property Tax Exist?

Unfortunately, there’s no such thing as states with no property tax. Every state charges real estate property taxes because they are used to fund essential government services like education, infrastructure, law enforcement, public transportation, parks and recreation, as well as water and sewer improvements. However, the phrase is still used by real estate investors to refer to the US states with the lowest property tax rates. In these states, property tax is so small that it’s basically negligible and doesn’t affect positive cash flow and return on investment. Keep in mind, however, that states with the lowest property tax rates might have higher costs elsewhere in order to make up for the costs.

Right, and that school is still getting tax dollars that would’ve otherwise been spent on his kids education! 
God bless you man, this isn’t that hard. It’s just not. 

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4 hours ago, DannyZuco said:

Monte--the only money that you are paying into the school district is your property taxes. Maybe in a round about way some of your sales taxes go there also, but that money goes to the general fund, where everybody takes a bite out of it. 

You can claim all your sales taxes each year on your taxes--so that could be a way to recoup your money back. But property taxes are here to stay, whether they go up or down--not a single state doesn't have property taxes.  But again, it was your choice to home school instead of use the public schools in your area. 

Do States with No Property Tax Exist?

Unfortunately, there’s no such thing as states with no property tax. Every state charges real estate property taxes because they are used to fund essential government services like education, infrastructure, law enforcement, public transportation, parks and recreation, as well as water and sewer improvements. However, the phrase is still used by real estate investors to refer to the US states with the lowest property tax rates. In these states, property tax is so small that it’s basically negligible and doesn’t affect positive cash flow and return on investment. Keep in mind, however, that states with the lowest property tax rates might have higher costs elsewhere in order to make up for the costs.

We are only talking about the circled amount. All of the other tax collected will remain the same. Homeschoolers should be exempt from this tax since their child is not in the ISD. Nor any other private school child. This is a ISD tax based on property valuation. It is not a property tax. You pay it with your other taxes that are based on your PROPERTY VALUE. It is an ISD TAX. 

97A97BC0-F2C2-4DEE-A65C-C8449D1B776A.jpeg

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6 hours ago, Youngcoach123 said:

We are only talking about the circled amount. All of the other tax collected will remain the same. Homeschoolers should be exempt from this tax since their child is not in the ISD. Nor any other private school child. This is a ISD tax based on property valuation. It is not a property tax. You pay it with your other taxes that are based on your PROPERTY VALUE. It is an ISD TAX. 

97A97BC0-F2C2-4DEE-A65C-C8449D1B776A.jpeg

I’ll go a giant step forward. Those homeschool kids should receive their cut of that tax from everyone else. 
School taxes are paid by property taxes  to see to it that the area youth are educated. Instead of being chained to the school of a politicians choice, all people should be given that money to spend at the school of their choice. 
 

Opponents of school choice will scream that “you already have choice” , but the truth is they know it isn’t A choice at all. Rich people already have a choice, it’s those less fortunate i feel sorry for. Those kids are the ones we are doing the disservice  for. 

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