If she only complied.

[DaveTV1]

12 hours ago, Old49er60 said:

Let’s see, elderly woman picking flower on side of the road. Posing zero threat. Obviously appears dazed. So could be under the influence, could be having a medical issue by the verbal response she gives him and his choice is to throw her to the ground. The fact that you decide that his actions correct is just scary. He was in the wrong and  it is obvious he did not have training on how to handle this type of situation other than throw her down and cuff her. 

I would bet that he was worried that he would be the laughing stock at the department for letting an old lady go, and now he's going to be seen as someone who likes to rough up granny which I think would be worse.  

[DaveTV1]

12 hours ago, Stoney said:

How should this situation have been handled?

This is completely different than the elderly woman.  She is obviously coherent, and her tail light has been out for a while and she knew.  She should have tired the red tape first.  Since she hadn't already been warned, he should have just given a warning.  He didn't think he should have, because she stated the tail light had been out for 6 months.  Then he escalated the situation after she said she'd sign the ticket.  This could have also been deescalated, but the cop took it to the next level when it didn't have to be.  

[DaveTV1]

11 hours ago, trashyhound said:

Both played a stupid game and both will probably win a stupid prize. 
Biggest concern i saw was pulling the service weapon when she stopped again. I couldn’t see Andy Taylor doing that, then again he wasn’t stopping aunt Bee either. 

At least this old woman didn't pull her cane on Barney, but I thought of this episode with the guy that pulled the knife.  His case was different since he was being an Ernest T. Bass, and throwing rocks.  

 

[DaveTV1]

8 hours ago, DannyZuco said:

First of all, she was NOT just picking flowers, she had recently left the walmart in loveland where she had stolen stuff. So she was not just picking flowers. Appears dazed--she puts both arms out like she was saying "what the heck do you want, why should I stop"--and she continues to walk away. Anyone can see that. It is the job of the police to protect the people and the businesses--that's the problem with the "woke" crowd--you want to be protected but can't stand what has to happen sometimes. Always complaining about he should have done this or that. He was arresting a criminal, the only time that I thought was might have been a little rough was when she was on the ground already and he continued to push her back down. But then again, she was trying to get up. 

The biggest problem you guys seem to have is that rule breakers can do what ever they are allowed to do, without consequences. Yet, I bet if someone stole from any of you, you'd be the first to file charges against them. 

Not if they were a 73 year old woman with obvious mental health issues.  

[DaveTV1]

6 hours ago, Youngcoach123 said:

You sure HE knew she was zero threat? How do?

You could tell with her actions and even her words that she wasn't a threat.  She said she was going home, well let the frail old woman go home.  

[DaveTV1]

3 hours ago, ObiOne said:

So every time an officer feels someone could be a threat, they should pull their service weapon?  

 

I actually think they should.  You never know when a perp is going to pull a gun on you.  You can't have that benefit of the doubt as seen with the fat cop and the woman with drugs in her purse in the other thread.  At least it appeared he had a bullet proof vest on, otherwise he would be dead.  

[Youngcoach123]

2 hours ago, Old49er60 said:

How do you know what he knows? You don’t we can only go off what we have seen. So where is the threat???? Oh there is not one

You said he knew she wasn’t a threat. Not me, how do you know? I never made any assertions.

[Youngcoach123]

37 minutes ago, DaveTV1 said:

You could tell with her actions and even her words that she wasn't a threat.  She said she was going home, well let the frail old woman go home.  

I totally agree that me, you and Old geezer think she isn’t a threat. But we don’t know if the officer felt that way. 

[Youngcoach123]

4 minutes ago, Old49er60 said:

 

We all get it. You have a deep fear on elderly women that might weigh 100lbs. Your fears are your fears. 

If he had felt a THREAT he would have called in BACKUP. I already said that. When officers see a threat it is what they are taught to do FIRST. Just go ahead and say you are just trying to argue because it is what you do. 

Lmao, Hemi!!! So you don’t know what he knew. Gotcha. Carry on

[Youngcoach123]

2 minutes ago, Old49er60 said:

Well this just says threat all over it. They made her go back in the store and leave the $14 worth of items and @Youngcoach123 seems to think she is a threat. He thinks the saw a threat............30 seconds was his entire interaction. @Youngcoach123 sometimes the best thing to do is just say you were  wrong and move on. 

 

https://www.denverpost.com/2021/04/19/loveland-police-arrest-dementia-investigation/

Loveland police officer Austin Hopp approached Karen Garner on June 26 after employees at a Walmart called to report that Garner tried to leave the store without paying for a T-shirt, a soda, a candy bar and wipes.

The employees made Garner return to the store and leave the items but called police to report the incident. Hopp found Garner walking along a road nearby.

Hopp forced Garner to the ground within 30 seconds of contacting her, body camera footage released by Garner’s attorney shows. Hopp and another officer, Daria Jalali, then held Garner against a police car. The officers fractured Garner’s arm, dislocated her shoulder and left bruises and scrapes, according to the lawsuit.

Lmao, how do you know what the cop thought!! You are seriously dense. Can’t just say, “I don’t, I was speculating by evidence that was available” or something along those lines. Inability to answer the question is you super power.

[BoyzNdaHood]

Poor lady, hope she owns that department soon

[DannyZuco]

9 hours ago, Old49er60 said:

Gosh Walmart employees did not see her as a threat yet @Youngcoach123believes an armed officer felt threatened by the 73 year old 80 lb woman picking flowers. So threatened he dislocated her shoulder. Maybe @Youngcoach123and the officer can do a group therapy session to overcome the fear of 73 year old 80lb women who are picking flowers. Thank goodness we have the brave walmart employees who did not feel the threat and just took back the $13.88 worth of items. 

 

https://www.cpr.org/2021/04/21/loveland-police-accused-of-using-excessive-force-on-73-year-old-woman/

On that June day last year, Garner left a local Walmart without paying for a T-shirt, soda, candy and wipe-refills, totaling $13.88 according to the suit. Walmart employees stopped her as she left the store and retrieved the items but did not let Garner pay for them. 

As she was walking home picking wildflowers, Hopp, one of the officers, stopped her and approached her. When she turned away from him and indicated she did not understand him, he grabbed her and pushed her to the ground. Court documents say Hopp “violently assaulted her, twisting her arms behind her back, throwing her to the ground and handcuffing her.”

If Walmart doesn't think she was a threat--why the heck were the police called on her? 

You did NOT give facts--you give your opinion of what you see. Fact--she stole from a business--criminal

Fact--she was uncooperative

Fact--KNOW ONE knows for sure what someone else will do in a situation

And I sure don't see her picking flowers like you continue to say, but maybe there is more video than what they have on this thread. 

[Straw]

10 hours ago, JETT said:

Poor lady, hope she owns that department soon

Why? What did the department store do wrong?

[ObiOne]

19 minutes ago, BoHogg said:

 

It is a sad/bad deal all the way around.  I see it from both sides.  Cops get a call on shoplifting.  Store doesn't know she has mental problems.  Cops don't know (at first) that she has mental problems.  They do their jobs like they are trained.  You can tell that the female officer figures it out about half way through the video.  She has this look on her face like what happened here wasn't exactly right.  Cops deal with bad people most all day and every day.  They thought (at first) this was a bad person doing bad things.  In hindsight and knowing the back story it is easy to second guess their actions.  I'm doing it myself and feel really bad for the little old lady.  But I don't think this was anything malicious on the leo's side.  Very unfortunate.  I think the real issue is that this poor lady really shouldn't be out in public on her own.  She would likely end up in a worse situation than getting manhandled by the cops if she stumbles into the wrong area of town.  I think the leo's could also use more training on recognizing mental issues.  But lets face it.  A high percentage of criminal have some sort of mental issues.  I wouldn't be a cop for $500,000 a year.  At least not a patrol cop.  Very tough job for relatively very little pay.

[BoyzNdaHood]

33 minutes ago, Straw said:

Why? What did the department store do wrong?

Let this type of boy work for them 

[DaveTV1]

21 hours ago, Old49er60 said:

I think he thought she was high and nothing would come of this. Having been around people who have it it can be mistaken when you first meet them

I've been around people that are high, drunk, and on drugs.  She clearly showed signs of dementia or perhaps her blood sugar was low.  I haven't been around someone who's blood sugar was low when they haven't taken their insulin, but I have heard that the symptoms are similar.  

[DaveTV1]

20 hours ago, Youngcoach123 said:

I totally agree that me, you and Old geezer think she isn’t a threat. But we don’t know if the officer felt that way. 

What was she going to do ?  Gum him to death ?  

[DaveTV1]

19 hours ago, Old49er60 said:

Well this just says threat all over it. They made her go back in the store and leave the $14 worth of items and @Youngcoach123 seems to think she is a threat. He thinks the saw a threat............30 seconds was his entire interaction. @Youngcoach123 sometimes the best thing to do is just say you were  wrong and move on. 

 

https://www.denverpost.com/2021/04/19/loveland-police-arrest-dementia-investigation/

Loveland police officer Austin Hopp approached Karen Garner on June 26 after employees at a Walmart called to report that Garner tried to leave the store without paying for a T-shirt, a soda, a candy bar and wipes.

The employees made Garner return to the store and leave the items but called police to report the incident. Hopp found Garner walking along a road nearby.

Hopp forced Garner to the ground within 30 seconds of contacting her, body camera footage released by Garner’s attorney shows. Hopp and another officer, Daria Jalali, then held Garner against a police car. The officers fractured Garner’s arm, dislocated her shoulder and left bruises and scrapes, according to the lawsuit.

I had a feeling that she suffered injuries.  I realize that someone much younger would not suffer those types of injuries, but with the elderly especially women who lose calcium in their bones there would be some injuries.  Seeing how her condition was in the video, I would bet that she thought she had paid for them.  They should have sent a social services person to check on her instead of this cop.  I think she should either be living with relatives, and if they decide an old folks home or senior care living center.  

[DaveTV1]

9 hours ago, DannyZuco said:

If Walmart doesn't think she was a threat--why the heck were the police called on her? 

You did NOT give facts--you give your opinion of what you see. Fact--she stole from a business--criminal

Fact--she was uncooperative

Fact--KNOW ONE knows for sure what someone else will do in a situation

And I sure don't see her picking flowers like you continue to say, but maybe there is more video than what they have on this thread. 

It sure looks like she has flowers in her hand where she's also holding her cellphone.  She doesn't even seem to recognize that he's a police officer even with the siren and lights on.  She probably doesn't even remember going to Wal Mart.  Geeze, do you not recognize dementia when you see it.  How did she steal from the business when they took it from her when she tried to leave the store, and then they wouldn't let her pay for it ?????  Then they call the police for what ?  She wasn't a threat then nor in the store.  It sounds like she did try to pay for it, why not let her, and forget about the whole situation.  They should sue Wally World and the Police Dept. for this.  See the video below.  Those Wal Mart employees messed up big time by not allowing her to pay for the items.  On that June day last year, Garner left a local Walmart without paying for a T-shirt, soda, candy and wipe-refills, totaling $13.88 according to the suit. Walmart employees stopped her as she left the store and retrieved the items but did not let Garner pay for them. 

[DaveTV1]

9 hours ago, Straw said:

Why? What did the department store do wrong?

They didn't allow for her to pay for the items, and then called the police over $13.88  of a lousy t shirt $8, a can of soda $1, candy $1, and wipe refills $3.  If I were that cop, I would have told her, I heard you had some trouble at Wal Mart earlier and couldn't purchase what you wanted.  I would have bought that old woman more than what she forgot to pay for.  Then I would have drove her home, and brought her groceries in to see what her living conditions were like.  I would bet that her house isn't in the best shape, and is in need of repair if she lives alone.  I also want to know where in the hell her family is, and why she isn't being cared for properly.  I'd need to know more information on that, because they could be charged with elderly abuse.  This woman evidently needs help, and not a fractured arm, dislocated shoulder, and bruises and scrapes from a 30 second encounter.  Even Barney Fife wasn't this rough with old lady's.  He was stern, but he didn't manhandle them. 

[DannyZuco]

19 minutes ago, DaveTV1 said:

  How did she steal from the business when they took it from her when she tried to leave the store, and then they wouldn't let her pay for it ?????  Then they call the police for what ?  

I asked this question earlier, if she wasn't a harm to the store or people, why did Walmart call the police about her shoplifting. IF they were NOT worried about her, they should NOT have called the police, which would not have lead to the arrest of this lady. 

Actions do have consequences in real life. She stole, the business called police, she would NOT stop, listen, or talk to police, she was arrested. But Personally, watching the video several times, I am not seeing the officer being as rough as the talking heads would make it out to be. Could they have been more gentle, Probably, but she was also not being cooperative at all--no where during the initial part was she cooperative at all. 

[DaveTV1]

9 hours ago, BoHogg said:

 

Please watch the middle of this video.  This cop should have already resigned for his actions.  The cop is out of breath, and is evidently out of shape.  4'10" and doesn't even know her date of birth, but at least knew her age.  If I were a P.I.G. (Pride, Integrity, Guts) I would lose all respect for this "fellow" cop.  Then when he's I suppose sanitizing his hands, he does it like he's made the biggest bust of his entire career.  Anyone that agrees with this cops actions, I hope your wife or sainted mother goes through a similar circumstance when she has dementia in her 70's.  

[DaveTV1]

1 minute ago, DannyZuco said:

I asked this question earlier, if she wasn't a harm to the store or people, why did Walmart call the police about her shoplifting. IF they were NOT worried about her, they should NOT have called the police, which would not have lead to the arrest of this lady. 

Actions do have consequences in real life. She stole, the business called police, she would NOT stop, listen, or talk to police, she was arrested. But Personally, watching the video several times, I am not seeing the officer being as rough as the talking heads would make it out to be. Could they have been more gentle, Probably, but she was also not being cooperative at all--no where during the initial part was she cooperative at all. 

So you didn't see where they hogtied her to put her in the car, because she didn't realize what in the world was going on.  Okay...

[DannyZuco]

Just now, DaveTV1 said:

So you didn't see where they hogtied her to put her in the car, because she didn't realize what in the world was going on.  Okay...

so you are saying they tied her feet to her arms, because that is what I think of when I think of hogtied. Again, we were NOT there, we see a video, we do NOT know what is going on in policeman's head or what he is suspecting. I will admit that he is way out of shape, especially hearing him breath. 

Again, it comes down to whether or not we are going to just allow--any and all criminals the right to walk away and do whatever the heck they want to do. That is what the leftist want to happen. I know that these situations are different for everyone, but shouldn't all crimes be treated the same. You break the rules, you pay the consequences--no matter how old or young you are? 

[DaveTV1]

6 minutes ago, DannyZuco said:

so you are saying they tied her feet to her arms, because that is what I think of when I think of hogtied. Again, we were NOT there, we see a video, we do NOT know what is going on in policeman's head or what he is suspecting. I will admit that he is way out of shape, especially hearing him breath. 

Again, it comes down to whether or not we are going to just allow--any and all criminals the right to walk away and do whatever the heck they want to do. That is what the leftist want to happen. I know that these situations are different for everyone, but shouldn't all crimes be treated the same. You break the rules, you pay the consequences--no matter how old or young you are? 

They tied her legs together or did you fail to see the strap, and he did bend her legs back, but didn't make the final tie.  You can see the strap even after they shut the door to the patrol vehicle.  I actually think the cop wanted to go that far once he bent her legs back.  The Wal Mart employees should have recognized that she was in a state of dementia.  They had retrieved the goods, and should have known this woman wasn't all there.  This woman wasn't even a threat.  Yet, you're making her out like she's Ma Barker or something.  May God have mercy on your soul.