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SOC vs PNG - 5A Div. II State Championship


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2 hours ago, Golfingnut said:

This was not the case in Saturday's game. The officials were supposedly from the Houston chapter. Supposedly one of those was from Groves. I say supposedly because that's what people are saying. They also said it was the official from Groves that made the PI call. 

I believe both teams have to approve the officials before the game. I would think that crews are chosen based on how they do throughout the year. 

Not in title game UIL assigns them

 

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5 hours ago, RETIREDFAN1 said:

Yes......they are professionals....they don't come into the game with prejudice....

Aren't they graded by each game and that's how they get to be chosen for higher profile games and/or move up to collegiate level officiating?

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10 hours ago, Coach0001 said:

Not in title game UIL assigns them

 

The UIL only assigns officials in the title game if both coaches agree....SOC agreed to the Houston crew but did not know one of the officials lived and worked in Port Neches.....to be fair that official only threw one flag all game and it was not the DPI...but I also think if I was SOC and I knew that fact I would not have chosen that crew either lol 

Edited by MattStepp
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1 hour ago, MattStepp said:

The UIL only assigns officials in the title game if both coaches agree....SOC agreed to the Houston crew but did not know one of the officials lived and worked in Port Neches.....to be fair that official only threw one flag all game and it was not the DPI...but I also think if I was SOC and I knew that fact I would not have chosen that crew either lol 

did not know or did not care to look at who the officials were on the crew? not sure who PNG uses in the regular season for officials Houston or if there is a Beaumont chapter but if I'm SOC and i can basically chose from any chapter in the state I'm going with somewhere a little further away than the team I'm playing against. 

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On 12/16/2023 at 6:21 PM, Lion7000 said:

He was offsides. I was wrong.

Screenshot 2023-12-16 at 6.19.22 PM.jpeg

In this photo, (there are better ones out there) the ball is already at the 46 yard line.  If you re-watch the game you will see that no one was even close to being offsides on the onside kick. It was executed perfectly.

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2 hours ago, Tex85 said:

did not know or did not care to look at who the officials were on the crew? not sure who PNG uses in the regular season for officials Houston or if there is a Beaumont chapter but if I'm SOC and i can basically chose from any chapter in the state I'm going with somewhere a little further away than the team I'm playing against. 

Typically most coaches ask fellow coaches the following things when vetting out crews; 

1) Is it a good crew?

2) Do they call it tight or let the kids play, if they call it tight what are they sticklers on? 

3) If its a late round playoff game, what games have they worked in the past?

I've never heard of a Coach going through each crew member and finding their hometown etc...maybe some do but most dont go that far. 

 

PNG uses Houston and SOC prefers Houston if they can't get a Dallas crew....but I do believe a lesson was learned maybe even if you like an opponents chapter its best to use a neutral crew to avoid a situation like this

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7 minutes ago, MattStepp said:

Typically most coaches ask fellow coaches the following things when vetting out crews; 

1) Is it a good crew?

2) Do they call it tight or let the kids play, if they call it tight what are they sticklers on? 

3) If its a late round playoff game, what games have they worked in the past?

I've never heard of a Coach going through each crew member and finding their hometown etc...maybe some do but most dont go that far. 

 

PNG uses Houston and SOC prefers Houston if they can't get a Dallas crew....but I do believe a lesson was learned maybe even if you like an opponents chapter its best to use a neutral crew to avoid a situation like this

The official in question did not make an impact on the game.  Sour grapes. 

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Just now, CS. said:

The official in question did not make an impact on the game.  Sour grapes. 

He did not....but as we all know sometimes those in charge have to do things to appease the community...anyone w/half a brain knows filing a protest etc with the UIL is jnot going to work....its for optics, people in charge can say "We did something"

The SOC coaches haven't said much at all, except it was a tough loss and that they didnt agree with the flag (no Coach will ever agree w/a tough call that goes against them) but they gave PNG a ton of credit....

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1 hour ago, MattStepp said:

 

 

PNG uses Houston and SOC prefers Houston if they can't get a Dallas crew....but I do believe a lesson was learned maybe even if you like an opponents chapter its best to use a neutral crew to avoid a situation like this

thats kind of what i was getting at, if we have a Dallas vs Houston area team i couldn't believe they weren't using an Austin/EastTexas/ sent in a crew from El Paso someone other than one of the home chapters. 

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3 hours ago, MattStepp said:

He did not....but as we all know sometimes those in charge have to do things to appease the community...anyone w/half a brain knows filing a protest etc with the UIL is jnot going to work....its for optics, people in charge can say "We did something"

The SOC coaches haven't said much at all, except it was a tough loss and that they didnt agree with the flag (no Coach will ever agree w/a tough call that goes against them) but they gave PNG a ton of credit....

I get what you are saying but to be clear, those in charge didn't have to do this to appease the community.  They chose to take that route.  They could have said "We agreed to the officiating crew.  We don't agree with the call that was made but sometimes judgement calls don't go your way.  We will accept the results and move on.  Congratulations to PNG."

Maybe not the easy response but the one some might think would send the right message to the players on the team as far as taking responsibility for the results you get even when you don't really want to.  

I realize what admin chose to do makes things easier on them and, ultimately, it's their call.  I just wanted to point out that their was another option available besides appeasement.  It just may not be popular.

 

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This was beat to death on another site and perhaps here too, but I don't have time to read through previous posts.  How can a program that is self-proclaimed "Legendary" and "The Mecca" let the game be close enough that they would even have to whine about the Refs?  Not to mention the "Death Row" defense.  SMH.  It would be better to show humility and full respect for opponents.  

I have no connection to either team, but by the end of that game I was so tired of seeing the ridiculous "Legendary" shirts.  If you're going to proclaim it, you need to be able to back it up.  Lots of teams have won back-to-back like SOC, so no, they are not "Legendary."  I'll leave that title to Aledo and Carthage and I don't recall seeing them putting these labels on their shirts and hats.

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SOC coaches gave credit where it was due, if you don't know the history behind the program maybe you should research a little.. the resources aren't there for that community a few plays away from a 3 peat... helluva season! Congrats PNG long time coming 

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1 hour ago, Everide2016 said:

This was beat to death on another site and perhaps here too, but I don't have time to read through previous posts.  How can a program that is self-proclaimed "Legendary" and "The Mecca" let the game be close enough that they would even have to whine about the Refs?  Not to mention the "Death Row" defense.  SMH.  It would be better to show humility and full respect for opponents.  

I have no connection to either team, but by the end of that game I was so tired of seeing the ridiculous "Legendary" shirts.  If you're going to proclaim it, you need to be able to back it up.  Lots of teams have won back-to-back like SOC, so no, they are not "Legendary."  I'll leave that title to Aledo and Carthage and I don't recall seeing them putting these labels on their shirts and hats.

IMO SOC is already legendary, to be an inner city school, to make 3 straight title games and win 2 of them absolutely legendary.

There's a reason what they've accomplished has never been done before in the inner city, because there's incredible hurdles and especially at SOC considering the condition the school was in before the community forced Dallas ISD's hand to get the school rebuilt...

SOC moves differently and some dont agree with it, they are a little boisterous and that definitely makes some feel a type of way....but the results speak for themselves and with what they've got coming in the pipeline I won't be surprised if they win a couple of more titles in the next few years. 

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4 hours ago, Everide2016 said:

This was beat to death on another site and perhaps here too, but I don't have time to read through previous posts.  How can a program that is self-proclaimed "Legendary" and "The Mecca" let the game be close enough that they would even have to whine about the Refs?  Not to mention the "Death Row" defense.  SMH.  It would be better to show humility and full respect for opponents.  

I have no connection to either team, but by the end of that game I was so tired of seeing the ridiculous "Legendary" shirts.  If you're going to proclaim it, you need to be able to back it up.  Lots of teams have won back-to-back like SOC, so no, they are not "Legendary."  I'll leave that title to Aledo and Carthage and I don't recall seeing them putting these labels on their shirts and hats.

 

2 hours ago, MattStepp said:

IMO SOC is already legendary, to be an inner city school, to make 3 straight title games and win 2 of them absolutely legendary.

There's a reason what they've accomplished has never been done before in the inner city, because there's incredible hurdles and especially at SOC considering the condition the school was in before the community forced Dallas ISD's hand to get the school rebuilt...

SOC moves differently and some dont agree with it, they are a little boisterous and that definitely makes some feel a type of way....but the results speak for themselves and with what they've got coming in the pipeline I won't be surprised if they win a couple of more titles in the next few years. 

Never done before in the inner-city?  Highland Park.  Same city.  Eight appearances.  Won five, with 3 in a row.  Perhaps I'm missing something.  I don't know the Dallas area very well.

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1 hour ago, Everide2016 said:

 

Never done before in the inner-city?  Highland Park.  Same city.  Eight appearances.  Won five, with 3 in a row.  Perhaps I'm missing something.  I don't know the Dallas area very well.

You are absolutely 100% missing everything if you are comparing Highland Park and South Oak Cliff lol 

 

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On 12/16/2023 at 5:30 PM, 514 said:

No. If you recorded it like I and watched the play the receiver initiated the first contact, trying to get separation. Ball was not in the air yet so offensive or defensive interference could not have happened. The the defensive back held his ground but but there was still a little separation then the defensive back, made up the ground and knocked it down. Was a horrible call that should’ve not been made. Port Neches Grove has to worry about people talking about this call. Who knows they could’ve scored a TD on fourth down but now a lot of people will say they won because of that call. it was like the official waited to see if receiver, caught the ball when he didn’t he called interference if he called holding then that’s something different should’ve stayed in his pocket.
 

image.png

Edited by prepballfan
Ball in the air as penalty takes place
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On 12/20/2023 at 12:48 PM, MattStepp said:

Typically most coaches ask fellow coaches the following things when vetting out crews; 

1) Is it a good crew?

2) Do they call it tight or let the kids play, if they call it tight what are they sticklers on? 

3) If its a late round playoff game, what games have they worked in the past?

I've never heard of a Coach going through each crew member and finding their hometown etc...maybe some do but most dont go that far. 

 

PNG uses Houston and SOC prefers Houston if they can't get a Dallas crew....but I do believe a lesson was learned maybe even if you like an opponents chapter its best to use a neutral crew to avoid a situation like this

One crew member was from Dallas.

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